Ray said...
@ Monsieur Beep -
I'm glad that you are resolving some of those 'family issues' that seem to plague many of us. There were a couple of your blog entries a while back that worried me, because you seemed to be very depressed. I'm glad you're now past that, and into
a better frame of mind.
Much like you, it took me far too much of my life to get even close to resolving a few of my own issues, and I found that forgiveness is not something I'm very good at, especially if the back of my head fits the repaired spots on the kitchen's drywall.
I'm lucky to be alive, and my dear departed daddy is lucky to have died in bed. I had other plans for him for quite a long time.
December 2, 2011 8:12 AM
TC [Girl] said...
Ray said...
"forgiveness is not something I'm very good at, especially if the back of my head fits the repaired spots on the kitchen's drywall.
I'm lucky to be alive, and my dear departed daddy is lucky to have died in bed. I had other plans for him for quite a long time."
I hear ya, Ray! Still trying to work through some of that "gunk," myself! Believe it or not, having to take care of an elderly woman has taught me to have more compassion...for my mother! I never dreamed that I could ever gain that for an abuser! :-(
What you posted re: Monsieur Beep: it's a beautiful story! Thanks for sharing! It gives me hope! :-D
December 4, 2011 1:08 AM
Ray said...
@ TC[Girl]
I wasn't sure about posting that on the blog, but then I thought maybe we need to know that we're not alone or unique, and that many of us are pretty-much alike, whether we live in Germany or Canada or the U.S.A., or wherever. Somewhere beyond our nationality or our ethnicity, inside us, we're all dealing with a lot of the same kinds of issues, and I think it helps sometimes to just put those out there and maybe find ways of helping one another to get beyond that, or rise above it, and perhaps become better people for having helped each other to do it.
If we look back over recorded history as far as that takes us, we will see that our technology has
steadily improved down through the ages, but we haven't improved our
emotional or behavioral characteristics hardly at all. We're still handling our interpersonal relationships very much the same as they did back in the days of ancient Egypt, when the first writing was developed and our records of history became possible. Emotionally and psychologically we're still back there in the third or fourth millennium B.C., not much further advanced than Ug and Mug, those intrepid cavemen of old.
December 4, 2011 2:18 AM
Tommy said...
Ray, thanks for starting this. As you all know, I'm dealing with my elderly mother and it's REAL tough. You see, I have some real issues that I have not resolved yet. Someday I hope to figure out that word forgiveness you speak of and how to apply it.
It's interesting, she sits there happy in her life and me, the son, sits there pissed off at the world and not able to know how to truely love and be happy. That tale from Monsieur Beep and the holding of hands touched me very deeply and I thank you for that. Hopefully before she dies, we'll be able to, at some level, share something simular. Who knows though.
December 5, 2011 5:40 AM
Ray said...
@ Thaimi & Tommy, and everyone -
As I suspected, we're all in that vast majority of people with similar problems related to relationships. Those seems to start with, but are not just confined to, our own families.
Thinking about it, maybe the problem is that nobody has ever insisted that we all take a class about 'Psychology 101 for Parents and Children' - or maybe just simply 'Before you can go out in the world, you have to read this!'
We get abused as kids because our parents knowingly or not are taking out their own insecurities and frustrations on us defenseless little kids, mostly because we're right there, and we can't fight back on their level. That in turn gets passed along because "It was good enough for me" or "This is how I was raised" or "Don't argue with your elders" - as if any of that contains a particle of sense or reason. It was more a tradition - "My parents were born unskilled and stupid about parenting, so I'm going to be the same!" Like it's a God-given right or something.
We are never formally taught while we are young enough to absorb it just how we ought to treat each other if we want to be liked or loved or respected by our peers.
We grow up "learning the hard way" and therefore repeating the same old mistakes that have been made by our ancestors for millennia.
And a lot of the so-called "training" we did get was pure horseshit, let's face it. It wasn't based on any academic knowledge or scientific formulae,
it was based usually on "I'm bigger than you are, and I'll beat the crap out of you if you don't shut up and do as I say!"
When my father was retired and I was in my forties, we finally had a serious talk about this, and I'm sure that in his own mind, he didn't even realize what a brute he had been while I was a little kid. He refused to believe what I told him of my own memories of those days, possibly because somehow he managed to blot out those incidents. But since those happened while my own memory banks were virtually empty of anything else at the time, I remember those things very clearly. Practically in "living color" as they say.
And that's the other aspect of it.
Adults often don't realize that events which don't really have a lot of deep significance to them may have really lasting impressions on little kids whose life experience is just developing as whose memories aren't already congested with the usual crap of daily life and work. They (or "we") don't put themselves in the other one's place and think about
how it may be received by the other person involved. It would take too long, or it isn't important enough, or they just don't think about it.
We need to start with kids while they are little, and teach them (and ourselves) how to interact with others in an effective but acceptable manner. I was going to say "civilized manner", but there really isn't any such thing, or we wouldn't be having this discussion.
December 5, 2011 7:40 AM
Monsieur Beep! said...
It all broke up once more and pointed to my deficits which I have deep within me in July this year when I got to know a lady which I had already been acquainted with over a 2 year period before that, but she´d been in disguise as a clown doing static display. So I had only known her voice. And even at that stage I felt attracted to her. We used to talk a few minutes, I tipped her, and walked on. Occasionally, I even didn´t visit with her at all.
It all changed in July when one night, after work, I accompanied her to her car, and she took off her gear. What a sweet tiny lady she was! I fell in love, well, no, I began to find her interesting, and being someone with probably the right chemistry.
We´ve been close friends (friends!) since July, we talk even more about her life as a single parent with a 6-year old child, and her making ends meet by doing her work as a static display artist.
And all this started a revolution within myself, because, although I´m in a partnership there hasn´t been the element of "deep" love and devotion: my partner and her family has been a "mere" substitute for my own incomplete and complicated family situation ever since I had been a baby. They gave me a lot of support.
Today, everything´s getting to "normal", nobody´s cross with each other within my family.
The new problem is: I´ve found someone whom I could/can devote my love to, which has been an impossible task up to now in my own partnership.
Yet I owe a lot to my partner, I couldn´t "just leave her", for she´s been a safe building block in my life.
But for a loving partnership, there ought to be more.
That´s in brief what´s been happening since July.
I´m on very good terms with my mom today, and her support helps me so much.
What was Tommy´s mom, to me has been my dad, I cannot call him "dad" or "pa" or "father", something deep within me does not allow calling him by such a "pet name".
Anyway, as I said, we are at good terms, I´ve gained a lot of invaluable experiences, and strangely enough, I wouldn´t want to have grown up in a normal family, after all. For then, I´d probably be just "normal", too, maybe. Not knowing what life is really about.
Ray, you´re right when you say we are still Ug and Mug persons, and still: the internet (flickr) has helped me tremendously, because I have been able to share my thoughts and troubles with a few close friends at flickr. And not forgetting your kind mentions on your blog, Ray.
I´m glad my derpressions also have vanished because of this, and I seem to have gained a totally new perspective of life now that I´ve gone through this (one of many before) deep trough.
There´s rarely a single problem, but usually one problem (parents), is the base for follow-up problems (relationsship, partnership), making the edifice of your life look like the tower of Pisa.
Much is already gained, though, if it doesn´t topple over, but keeps being tilted but rigid.
Ray, and also TC and Tommy: it feels good to have friends who can communicate not by smoke but by bits and digits.
Thank you for your kind posts and comments, I intend to add them as extra posts to my own blog, if you don´t mind.
And sorry if my comment is a bit brief, and probably partly unintelligeable, but it´s hard to condense a whole life into the few lines of a comment.
Take care, all.
December 8, 2011 5:10 AM
